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Interview with Karen from Logo’s “Coming Out Stories”

Gay cable channel Logo recently debuted Coming Out Stories, a reality series which chronicles queer men and women coming out to someone significant in their lives on-camera. In their first episode, they profiled Karen, a 27-year-old single mother who was out to everyone in her life except her sister and her mother, who has a fatal brain disease. Karen came out to both on camera, with emotional and uplifting results.

Since the episode aired, Karen’s life has changed in many ways. She talks to us about her experiences making the episode, coming out to her family, and coming out to the world on national television.

AfterEllen.com: So, how did you get involved with this television series?

Karen: It’s so funny how it happened. I was looking around the MTV website for an artist I heard on the radio and there was a casting call link. I clicked on it, just to see. I’d had an audition for American Idol so I was kind of interested. I scrolled down and there it was: “Are you lesbian or gay and is there someone significant in your life who you would like to come out to?” I thought, Wow, how great would that be? My mom doesn’t know. I’m 27 years old. It would be great to tell her. So, I sent an e-mail and they were very interested and I got a call the same day.

AE: And then how long after that did you actually film this?

K: We filmed it six months ago from now. But after I got the call they were at my house within a few weeks to see my environment. And then we started taping a month later. It happened very quick.

AE: Before you saw that ad you must’ve thought about coming out to your mom and sister, but is this what sparked you to say, It’s high time, now I’m really going to do it?

K: Exactly. It’s funny because I honestly think that if it wasn’t for the show, I probably to this day would still not have told my mom or my sister. And I’m so glad that I did. So, that pushed me.

The twist of my story, if you want to call it a twist, is that my mom is sick. She has an incurable brain disease and she only has a few years left, if that. We’re hoping for two more. So, it was a big decision to make. Why would you want to upset someone who’s dying? You left it alone, so you might as well keep it that way. Why cause her any shock? Hey, Mom, guess what?

I really struggled with it, but the show gave me an opportunity to bring us closer. And why wouldn’t I take an opportunity to get closer to my mom while she only has a few years left? So, I was really torn apart on what to do.

AE: Did you actually have people telling you you shouldn’t do this to her, why upset her, or was that your conscience telling you?

K: I had a few people telling me they were against it, said absolutely don’t do it, but they were people that also don’t know me and my mom and how close we are. The people that did, they supported me on it. They were like, 100%, go for it.

AE: Can you say why you think you might not have done it sooner with your mom if you guys are very close? Was it a fear of how she would react?

K: I had disappointed my mom throughout my life. You know, as a child. You can’t be perfect, and I felt like I disappointed her because I didn’t graduate from college when I should have, I got pregnant when I was 19 years old. It was an early fluke thing that happened in my life, and so I kind of messed up a little there for a little while. And I just thought, I don’t want to disappoint her anymore. So I left it alone for a long time and never brought it up. She never had a clue. Then, I’m just so strong in who I am that I felt like I was lying to her constantly and hiding constantly.

AE: So having done it, do you feel like you have disappointed her or would not telling her have been a disappointment?

K: Um, I’m happy that I told her. You know, the selfish side of me is happy because I felt like a weight has been lifted. I don’t have to lie anymore. I can be open and honest about who I am because I can be open and honest to others about who I am. Because when you lie to someone about yourself, you’re really lying to yourself as well. So that part is lifted.

Now, as far as my mom, it has brought us closer. She has accepted it. She’s okay with it. One of the funniest things about the show?it’s hysterical, people just laugh and cry through the whole thing. And at the end my mom says to me, “You know, this is no great big deal.” I said, “It’s not?” “No, Karen. I had two divorces and if I could start all over again, I’d probably do it your way.” And I just fell apart laughing. I couldn’t believe that she said that. Oh my God, Mom. I can’t believe you just said that!

AE: So she was able to joke about it. This was right after you did it?

K: It was within a second of me telling her. She was fine with it. And then, I was like, “Mom, I can call you now and say, ‘Hey, I have a date.’ And you can say, ‘what’s her name?’ And she goes to me, “Yeah, we’ll talk.” [Laughs]

AE: That’s asking a little too much just yet, I guess.

K: Yes. So I was kind of pushing the envelope there. But she met the girl I was dating at the time, Kelly. It was great. My mom said, “What’s up with you two? And Kelly said, “I really like your daughter.” Kelly’s great. And my mom said, “Welcome to the family.”

AE: Wow. Even though you were afraid to do this?like all of us are at whatever point in our lives before we come out?but knowing your mom, did you have a sense that in the end she would be accepting? She must be a pretty open-minded, accepting person to that quickly be okay with it.

K: Yeah, she is. She’s a Catholic, old-school Italian mother, so in that respect I thought that she was going to flip. But I really do believe that because of her disease, it has opened her mind up to the more important things in life, like life itself. Which is great. Not that she wouldn’t have accepted it before the disease. I’m sure she eventually would have. But now she takes everything with a grain of salt. You know, “Okay, I can deal with this. I’m not going to waste another moment of my life being upset with my daughter.”

She’s okay with it. She’s fine and it’s great. I was out to lunch with her on Sunday and she wanted to know about the girl I was dating. I had mentioned her name and she had said, “Who’s that?” I told her we’re dating and she started asking questions. If my mom doesn’t want to know anything she won’t say anything. But she was actually like, “Where’d you meet her?” and “How long have you guys been seeing each other?” I’m like, “All right!” Now we can pretty much talk and it’s normal. It’s great.

My mom is such a hero in the gay community, you have no idea.

AE: So it sounds like you guys were already close, but now you’re close on a whole different level.

K: Absolutely.

AE: You came out to your sister as well on the show, right?

K: I did, I did. But my sister had an idea, even though we never talked about it. Emotionally, I was a mess, crying, and I actually had to walk away at one point. I went completely pale and I thought I was going to throw up because my sister and I are also very close. And because my mom’s sick, my dad’s not around and I have my son?me and my sister are pretty much just the two of us. We support each other. And if she ever mentioned anything about it for the past, you know, 13 years, I would change the subject. So she knew she probably shouldn’t bring it up. She had an idea but we had never officially talked about it.

So I was so upset telling her because I thought, not that she’d be mad that I was gay, but that she would be mad, like, “You know, Karen, there’s no reason why you couldn’t have told me ten years ago.” You know, keeping it from her and lying. I became a mess because I was sorry and regretful?I thought I’d be hurting her. But she just hugged me and said, “I’m so glad you finally came out with it. I can’t wait to hear some good details.” She was into it and said, “You know, that was a brave thing for you to do.” Which really it’s true.

People are closeted their entire lives. They never come out. You know, the husband, the kids, wives?they just completely cover it. It’s one thing coming to terms with it yourself and it’s another thing to come to terms with it with family members. And then I’m not even going to mention it, but it’s a whole other thing to do it in front of 15 million people.

AE: Did it all take place within one day or how long were they with you?

K: There was five days of taping.

AE: All the time?

K: Pretty much. Yeah. I think the last day was just getting some of my family pictures, just taking shots of things that they might need for editing purposes, things like that. But there were four solid days of filming where they were with me full-time.

AE: Do you think that it changed how you came out to your family and how they received it just because of the fact that there were cameras there?

K: No, not in how I came out to my mom, no. On the show you’ll see I struggled with what to say, where to go, how to do it. Should I give her a gift? Should I write her a card? I struggled over every aspect of it. And thinking back now, I definitely would not have shouted out and used the words “gay” or “lesbian,” because to old-school adults, that can have negative connotations attached. So I said that I dated women. That’s how I phrased it. I definitely wouldn’t have changed that.

I gave her a gift, a clock and I engraved it, because time was relevant for us. And I definitely would have done that again, because I’m always doing that. I love to give gifts to people. I definitely would have marked the day, because it was a big day for us. I took her to her favorite park. I was thinking, Should I bring her to the club, the bar and restaurant? I wanted her to see that we’re not caged animals, we’re regular people. But then I finally decided that instead of putting her out of her comfort zone and into mine, I thought about what was best for my mom. So, no, I wouldn’t have done anything differently because of the cameras. Definitely not.

I feel so much better about myself since I did this, even though my mom was sick and I jeopardized that a little bit. You know, should I tell her because she’s sick? But not everybody is going to be in that situation, and I’m definitely for coming out, even if they know that their parents are homophobic. Believe me, I would not tell anybody to come out if they were not comfortable with it. My friend came out to her dad and her dad mailed her her birth certificate. I mean, a “here you go, you’re no longer part of our family” type of thing. What she did was, she was helping out herself. She was coming to terms with who she was by doing that. And that’s what’s important.

AE: And the same goes for coming out to your sister?

K: Yeah, I just brought her outside and started crying and said, “I’ve held something back for so long and I’m sorry, but I’m a lesbian.” Yeah, I just came out. [Laughs]

AE: So, how old is your son?

K: He’s seven.

AE: What does he know? What have you been able to tell him at seven?

K: I remember in kindergarten two years ago, my son was asked to draw a picture of his family, and he drew a picture of two women holding hands with him in the middle. So he was five, maybe six, at the time. He’s fine. He doesn’t know know. He doesn’t know how to put it into words, but he understands the concept of what’s going on. I don’t put anything in front of him, because there’s a maturity level and I’m very careful with him. We’re very, very close. Because that’s basically all we have, each other. I say he’s all the man I need. [Laughs]

AE: When you decided to do the show, did you know what to expect?

K: No. Even when the camera crew came, you never know what’s going to happen. Is it really going to air? Is someone going to break their contract? With all the media stuff you don’t know. But when I actually saw my commercial for the first time, then I knew, okay, this is really going to happen, and I need to start doing something.

I built a website [www.karenscomingout.com]. It’s brand new today. And then I started thinking, I can’t wait to travel this country and talk to people about this. I really can’t wait. It’s what I want to do, big time. I want to help out the youths, and even adults, who haven’t come out. I’m actually going to contact some of the universities in cities that have large gay populations and hopefully I can get down there and speak about coming out and the importance of it to yourself and to your family and things.

AE: Right. You can’t be responsible for how other people are going to act, but it sounds like it’s been a great experience for you. Luckily you’ve had a good reaction. So you’ve been getting tons of mail?

K: My God, I get so much! I am shocked at how much. And I get scared, because some of these women, and some men, I’m getting e-mails from are 19, 20 years old. It’s a very tough time, especially for coming out. And they are saying to me, “I’m not out. Help me. What do I do here?” They’re reaching out to me. So now I feel like, because I put it out there I now have these young people, this crowd looking up to me and reaching out to me to set the example. And I don’t have the resources or the tools to guide and help these people. So what I did was put a link right on the front page of my website to the Human Rights Campaign. They are huge on coming out. Huge.

So, I can’t help them, but I can just tell them to be strong and really let them know that they are not alone and there are people out there that will help them. I will certainly talk to them about my experience, and a lot of people are asking me for copies of the show because they want to play it for their parents before coming out to them. It is so unbelievable how many people are now coming out since they saw my show that I’m shocked.

At the time it was about me and my mom, and the cameras gave me that push to do it and I’m so glad, I’m so grateful. I owe them everything. But no, I had no idea. It’s overwhelming.

AE: Yeah, I can imagine.

K: I’m happy. I’m so happy that people can look at it as an example and say, “Look at that woman who is sick and she loves her daughter so much and it didn’t even shock her as far as getting upset or anything.” My mom cried before I told her, because I gave her a card that talked about our relationship between a mother and daughter. And she literally broke down into hysterics over this card, and I hadn’t even told her. I was about to tell her, but I hadn’t even told her yet! It was like, Oh my God, Mom. Why are you crying? She thought I had something horrifying I was going to tell her, but I was like, no. And it’s so emotional and I had no idea about the impact. But now I feel like I have a responsibility. I really do. And I’m happy to do it. Thrilled.

So I guess the only other thing that I would like to do with the exposure from the show would be to be on The L Word. [Laughs] I just want to make a cameo, that’s all I want to do. If they seat me in the bar, off to the side, I’m happy.

AE: So, what next? You’re studying marketing, right?

K: Yeah. I just have one paper to go and I’ll graduate. I already do freelance marketing now. That’s my job. So I get to make my own schedule and still be able to take care of my son and take care of my mom and help out in that way. So I really tried my best to get a schedule that would fit so everybody could get the time that they need.

AE: So that’s a career that you plan to stick with, you’re going to continue with that?

K: Yeah, I’m going to continue with that absolutely. I definitely would like to start helping out wherever I’m needed as far as coming out and any type of lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender issues that are going on. I would definitely offer myself in as many ways as possible to help out. Definitely. Not because I feel responsible but because I want to. I definitely want to. It’s such a good thing that happens.

AE: You said you were contacting schools to go there and speak. Has anything come of that yet?

K: No, I’ve just spoken locally. I’ve been invited to some of the clubs locally, which has been great. There were two clubs that the cameras went to. One is called Bounce and the other is Sisters. And it’s unbelievable. The other night at Sisters this woman came walking up to me and she was shaking. I could see her hands shaking and she was in tears. She kind of like reached out an arm that was trembling and grabbed my arm and I just walked over and put my arms around her. I didn’t know what her situation was, and so I hugged her and she just said, “Thank you.” Then she turned around and she walked away. And I heard that the crew that saw the whole thing before they put it on Logo, they were crying. One was absolutely a basket case, with tissues, and that person is gay too, so they could relate.

AE: Thank you so much, Karen. It’s great what you’re doing and I’m glad we can give you a little more of an audience.

K: Thank you. I’m so glad and I hope your readers enjoy it.

Karen’s episode of Coming Out Stories will re-air on Logo on November 7th and 13th. For more information, visit logoonline.com, or Karen’s personal website at karenscomingout.com.

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