TV

“Episodes” star Kathleen Rose Perkins gives us the scoop on her new lesbian storyline

photo credit: Ricky Middlesworth

Kathleen Rose Perkins has been a working actor for over 15 years, with guest spots on everything from How I Met Your Mother to Grey’s Anatomy, to American Horror Story to NCI: Los Angeles. Oh, and landed a part in a nothing little film called Gone Girl. Maybe you’ve heard of it? Not bad for a Michigan girl who spent her lean LA years as a receptionist at Merrill Lynch and almost gave up on Hollywood.

Today, Perkins is best known for her adorkable, high-strung portrayal of people-pleasing, boss-bedding, weed-smoking TV executive Carol Rance on Showtime’s hit comedy, Episodes.

We talked to Kathleen recently to discuss why she loves Carol’s new lesbian relationship, what’s that thing she does with her hands when she’s hiking, and how her face deserves its own Emmy Award.

AE: Thank you so much for taking the time to do this interview.

KRP: I have to thank you for writing such an awesome article. That was so cool to see! Thank you for trying to garner more viewers for our show, I so appreciate it.

AE: Are you kidding? I’ve been a fan of Episodes since the beginning. AfterEllen didn’t really have a reason to cover it until this season’s lesbian storyline. We’re going to focus a lot on the Carol-Helen thing. I say that because I don’t want you to think I’m just some weirdo who only wants to talk about lesbians.

KRP: No, let’s talk about lesbians! That sounds great!

AE: Oh, OK. In that case, I’m totally that weirdo. When did you find out that your character, Carol Rance, was going to be in a relationship with a woman this season?

KRP: [Co-creators] David Crane and Jeffrey Klarik—who are a gay couple, by the way—told me about it in 2010 (Season 1.) Carol was never going to be the boss, she was always going to be number two, and she was always going to have an affair with the boss who came in to take over the network. And eventually, it was going to be a woman. So, yeah. We knew from the beginning that this was what was going to happen.

AE: Whoa. I had no idea they planned this from the get-go.

KRP: I couldn’t wait to get to this season. I think they did it in a really beautiful way. I knew this was going to be the most fun that this character was going to have. But also, I couldn’t wait to see how we would earn this, because it’s a leap, you know? I couldn’t wait to find out how the audience would take to the storyline. It’s really been my favorite season so far, mainly because I get to have a relationship that was so much fun to play.

AE: It’s totally within Carol’s wheelhouse, but also takes her in a new direction that you never saw coming. What do you like most about the story line?

KRP: My favorite part is that it’s the healthiest relationship Carol has ever been in. She’s always pretending to be happy, but is never happy. This is the first time that I’ve ever played Carol as truly happy. She’s in this really fun, loving, respectful relationship with this person who treats her well. This is just a whole new world for Carol. This woman actually likes her. And, I had more chemistry with Andrea Savage [who plays Helen Basch] than I’ve had with the men.

AE: Is Carol is bisexual now?

KRP: What do you think?

AE: Actually, I though of a term that I think is more appropriate for Carol. I think she’s boss-sexual.

KRP: [laughs] Oh no! I wish to God I had come up with that! That’s brilliant!

AE: You can have it!

KRP: That’s fantastic! Oh my God, that’s fantastic. You know, yes. That’s exactly what she is. The first requirement for Carol being attracted to someone is they are in some sort of authority position. Eventually, in one episode, Beverly refers to her as a lesbian. And I say, “I don’t think I’m a lesbian.” So Beverly asks, “What do you think you are?” And Carol says, “I don’t know. I feel uncomfortable with labels.”

AE: Ha! That’s exactly what makes her a lesbian: eschewing labels. Seriously, that’s the gayest thing Carol could have said.

KRP: That’s great! I’ll relay that to the producers.

AE: I like Carol’s friendship with Beverly. There are so few stand-alone female friendships in television comedies. What’s with that?

KRP: My favorite part of each episode is playing the relationship between Beverly and Carol. I’ve actually become really close friends with Tamsin Greig, who plays Beverly. There’s a friendship between [the character] Sean and Matt LeBlanc, a bromance between them, but it’s not as deep and complex as Beverly and Carol. They just sit it bars. We get to go hiking and smoke pot. I cherish those [hiking] scenes. They’re some of my favorite scenes.

AE: That reminds me. What is with Carol’s hiking hands? What are you doing there?

KRP: Listen. A long time ago, when my mother was on a health kick, she started speed walking. And they do “heel-toe,” but they also move their arms like that, to get their core working. When they added these hiking scenes, I had no idea how Carol would walk in flat shoes because she’s always in heels. Really painful heels. So, I had this idea that, as crazy as she is, Carol went to a walking specialist and learned how to walk in this really funny way. And Carol flexes her palms up because she’s gotten really weird with it. That’s just me try to make something more funny.

AE: Mission accomplished. Who’s the better kisser, Merc or Helen? No offense to John Pankow, but I think I know the answer to this.

KRP: Andrea has great lips, so Helen, of course. They had auditions for the role of Helen Basch, and I was lucky enough to do some chemistry reads with a couple of different actresses. And when Andrea came in, I was like, “I like her. She’s hot! I think that’s what Carol would go for.”

AE: But it’s a comedy rule that no one is allowed to be happy, so I’m already worried for the two of them. Please tell me Carol and Helen at least make it to the end of this season?

KRP: [laughs] You know I can’t say anything or it would spoil everything! And I’m dying. I want to tell you everything and I want to find out if you like what happens. I can’t wait to find out how people feel about how everything goes down. It’s so great!

AE: You’re killing me.

KRP: The finale episode of this season? My mouth was agape the whole time. I can’t believe where they put these characters. I don’t want to say if it’s a good place or a bad place, or what happens, but it’s a great roller coaster ride.

AE: Carol is the character you’ve played the longest, right?

KRP: Yes. She’s the best character I’ve ever been able to play. Because of the longevity of it, but also because she’s not one-note. Every season, I see a new side of Carol in the writing that I had no idea existed before.

AE: Speaking of surprising sides, I had no idea you have a third degree black belt in taekwondo. That’s badass. Aren’t all actresses supposed to do yoga?

KRP: Actually, yoga kind of hurts my body. I’m really into taekwondo and have been doing it for about 15 years now, and I love it. It’s a great way to get your aggressions out, and to also understand your body and being rooted and grounded, the control of distance with other people, and also knowing that if someone was trying to assault me, I feel like I could hold my own. I don’t ever want to find that out, but I think that’s what all women should have.

AE: But it’s a contact sport. Aren’t you worried about your face?

KRP: Yeah, well. I do very little sparring with other people. Mostly, I do pads and they can’t hit back. I can’t have anything happen to my face or else I can’t work for a while.

AE: Protect the moneymaker! Your expressions and your reactions on the show are everything. You deserve a Face Emmy, which is something I just made up.

KRP: [laughs] That’s great! I wish to God they had those, how awesome would that be? You know what, I would love that. That would mean more to me than a regular Emmy. Hopefully, the statue would be animatronic, so the face would move. That would be amazing.

AE: That’s brilliant! But the Face Emmys wouldn’t be broadcast. It would be a luncheon. Sorry.

KRP: Oh yeah, it wouldn’t actually be on CBS.

AE: Do you do anything else in addition to acting?

KRP: I’m an aspiring writer. I’ve done a few pilots and one screenplay that I would never show anyone. [laughs] I would like to eventually get good enough that I could be a writer. You have more say in the characters that you portray if you write your own stuff.

AE: Are you concentrating on half-hour comedies?

KRP: Comedies and buddy comedies for women. That’s all I want to do. I want to write another Laverne and Shirley. I just want to write for women. I like them.

AE: Since you only shoot Episodes for two months, you have 10 months to work on your pilot.

KRP: Yeah. I should be able to get something done.

AE: I want to see a pilot by December.

KRP: [laughs] Oh yeah, no problem.

AE: You could write a role for yourself, produce it yourself, and direct yourself.

KRP: Actually, I want to produce and write a one-woman show.

AE: Excellent! I will be in the front row. And I’ll bring 10 friends.

KRP: OK!

Kathleen can be seen in her one-woman show someday, in the feature film, The Skeleton Twins, starring Kristen Wiig and Bill Hader, now, and of course, on Episodes, every Sunday at 10:30pm ET/PT on Showtime.

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