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An interview with Butterfly Boucher

I spoke with Australian musician Butterfly Boucher almost a month and a half ago, but it wasn’t until now that I’ve had the opportunity, or really the room left in my mind, to concentrate on much. I apologize that it has taken so long for me to get this to you all – especially after figuring out our conversation ended up being exactly what I needed to hear.

Boucher’s most recent album is a fantastic self-titled journey through many of the ups and downs of life, love and the crap we all have to go through that ultimately helps us shape our future adult decisions and hopefully plays a part in making us better people. So while I stare at the lemons life has so generously put in my lap lately, I’m going to think of what drinks I can put them in as a garnish instead of waiting for them to rot in the back of my mind.

As we spoke, the incredibly friendly Boucher was dealing with allergies from Nashville while I was sniffling here in Chicago. We talked about her busy schedule, exploring new creative outlets, working with Missy Higgins and doing what she can to get everyone to dance.

Butterfly Boucher: I’ve been here in Nashville for twelve years now and it’s just gotten really good. I mean, there was always something that drew me here like the pace of life and meeting really good friends. But the city has just gotten really good in the last three or four years. And to the point where I’m like proud of it? It’s weird!

AfterEllen.com: Yeah, my mom lives there and I’ve loved it when I’ve visited. BB: I mean honestly, I didn’t even tell people I lived in Nashville, especially when it came to music, because people just had this preconceived notion about what kind of music comes out of Nashville. And I just didn’t want to be put in that box. It just wasn’t ever really my thing.

And I remember early on when I was working on my first album, someone asked me where I live and that’s when I learned not to say that I lived in Nashville or that I recorded it in Nashville because then they always say, “Oh yeah, I can really hear the Nashville influence on the album.”

AE: Um, really? BB: [Laughs] Yes! I was just like, “What because I used an acoustic guitar or something?” I was really taken aback. But now it’s just really eclectic in terms of what kinds of musicians are coming to record here. So I’m drawing influence from a bunch of great muses.

AE: Oh yeah. In my opinion it kind of almost seems like a second Austin. BB: Yeah I think so. It has that vibe to it. It doesn’t have as many venues yet; but the level of musicianship here is pretty outstanding. Like I go to other cities and, LA and New York have amazing musicians too, but the standard here is really high. It’s pretty remarkable. I feel like I’ve been spoiled actually.

AE: Oh yeah? BB: Yeah because your friends introduce you to more friends and anywhere else they would be like the top paid musicians and there’s no way I could afford them. [Laughs] But in Nashville I can be like, “Hey want to play a show? I can only pay you like fifty dollars.” And they’ll be like, “Yeah that’d be fine.”

AE: I don’t know, the secret’s out now. BB: I know I shouldn’t have said it! [Laughs]

AE: Well I really should have first thanked you for taking the time to talk to me. I know that when I reviewed your new album a lot of our readers were really psyched about it. I was really happy that it was streaming on Spinner too! BB: Yeah! That was for the first week it was released; they hooked me up there. That was really cool and actually Amazon was really cool to me too because they were offering my album for the month of May for five dollars. So that’s been really good for sales. As an indie, you know, there aren’t a lot of albums being bought. But when we saw what we sold last week it was really encouraging.

AE: That’s great! BB: I mean because there is just so much music out there. When you go on iTunes and you search for one artist, it comes up with this list of other artists you may like if you download whatever you’re looking at and it just keeps going and going. So I get to the point where I’m like, “I need to stop looking at this because I’ll wonder why I’m trying to do what thousands of other people are doing.” There’s so many of us out there putting out music and hoping people will buy it and enjoy it.

AE: I mean I’m sure, but obviously you’ve got something special. I’m assuming a lot of that can be attributed at least partially to the fact that you have basically literally been making music since you were born. BB: [Laughs] Yeah I came out singing pretty much. The one thing I do get overwhelmed with is just knowing that there are so many people out there doing the same thing who have the same job as me and are going through the same questions of how do we get people to listen to and buy the album, you know? But the truth is, the reason I do this, is because it is in my blood and I’m going to do it anyway.

My career has already kind of started changing and broadening in ways that I wasn’t doing as much stuff 10 years ago. I was a lot more focused on just my solo career. And I think that experience and being focused on that was good for me at that time in my life. But now it’s broadening where I’m looking to do more producing for other artists and writing for other people. I have a different band called Elle Macho – I have a lot more outlets. It’s kind of like – I guess the thing for me with the solo album – it took me about a year and a half to make it. Granted that was on and off. I was touring and playing for Sarah McLachlan and in between those dates I would come home and have two days to work on the album. It was kind of stretched out. And then I had these two months off and that’s when I was really going to sit down and work on my own album. But that’s right when I started talking to and writing with this other artist called Missy Higgins. And then I was like, “Let me produce this album!” [Laughs] So then the next two months of writing became producing and working with her.

AE: You two seem to have such a great time together. I was just watching some of the videos you’ve posted to YouTube. BB: [Laughing] Those videos are fun. She is such a down-to-earth person. It is so easy to be her friend; anybody could be Missy Higgins’ friend. She’s just an open, generous person.

AE: Well she’s also a fellow Aussie so is it kind of like having a piece of home with you? BB: Yeah, that’s definitely true. It was nice to have another Aussie around for a bit.

AE: I particularly liked the “None the Wiser” video. It sounded great but it also totally cracked me up when Missy kept stroking your hand. BB: Oh my God it was so funny at the time. That was a really hard song to play and we had only just learned it like an hour before.

 

AE: Really? That was awesome! BB: She’s such a fast learner she just got it so fast. And it was like we kept stopping up and it was getting to the point where we’re either going to have a lot of fun with this or we’re going to get really annoyed because we kept messing up. So that was maybe the ninth take or something. So I went to start playing and she did that and it just cracked me up. And the funny part is she actually did it twice on my hand and then I actually started singing it and she did that on my face and I kind of lost it but we kept playing. But we thought that was a little too much so Rob, the guy that was recording it, that’s when he cuts away to the blue chair. That’s when it looks like maybe he was trying to get artsy. [Laughs] Then we come back but it’s obvious that we’d been laughing.

AE: It sounded so great! BB: Well good, thank you! Yeah that’s a fun song and I think we’ll actually play that. I’m going to be opening for her and then also playing in her band in Australia which is her first tour there in years. It’s really exciting. She announced the dates a couple of weeks ago or maybe not even that long and most of the shows have sold out and we’re scrambling to add new dates. So it’s pretty exciting. So we’re going to try to find a Casio and play “None the Wiser.”

AE: You absolutely should. I mean, I was thinking – and maybe this would be good for when you’re touring Australia together – you two should do a musical Portlandia-type web series. BB: Oh my God!

AE: Yeah just the two of you, a keyboard and just hanging out and performing. BB: Yes that would be great! It’s funny because once the camera starts rolling it’s like we both have these little performer type comedians come out of us. Turn the cameras off and we’re still silly and goofy but there’s something that kicks in when the video starts recording and you start doing stupid stuff. But we totally should! We should do a little video bit. And definitely Portlandia. I like that reference

AE: Well I would post it here, I’m just sayin’. Actually I could watch videos of just your dance challenge submissions for days. BB: Aren’t they sweet! I just love it. Every time somebody does one it’s unbelievable. I watch them and just feel so happy. The biggest thing is that they’ve actually gone to the trouble of downloading the mp3, setting up a video camera getting their friend involved and just doing it. Having the balls to do it.

 

AE: Totally because people on the internet are assholes. BB: [Laughs] Yeah these people are just doing it. Everybody always says they’re going to do it and then maybe half of them have done it.

AE: I saw Missy‘s and hers could be a workout video. She was sweating by the end. BB: Well and she told me later she had done it several times so she was quite puffed by the time she was done. She was like, “I had to find a balance between being fun and accidentally being too inappropriate.” [Laughs]

AE: So, I’m thinking about adding my own, is it too late? BB: No! There’s really no deadline for it. I want it to be this ongoing thing that people do when they get inspired. And eventually I want to maybe put them together and make another “5678!” video. I was just waiting until I got enough but there’s no deadline.

AE: Maybe I can convince some of the other AfterEllen people to do it. BB: That would be brilliant if you can. That would be hilarious. I don’t know what it is, there’s just something about dancing – you don’t have to be the best dancer and it’s still entertaining. It was so fun to watch other people dance.

AE: Sure! I like to listen to that song at the end of this album it’s a catharsis. It’s a total release after such an emotional album. BB: Yeah it is. It’s kind of interesting that that first single was so upbeat. I kind of purposely did that because I didn’t want this album to come across as gloomy or anything like that even if there are very sad moments and it’s kind of heavy lyrically. I did feel like musically it was creative. I didn’t feel like it was depressing.

AE: Oh I agree. BB: Yeah so I guess it’s kind of funny because it is sort of the most uptempo, kind of fun song on the album. So some might say it’s not a true representation of the album. I kind of was like, I want to come out with something really joyful to announce the album. So it is kind of a nice release I guess to go back to the beginning of the album once you’re finished. [Laughs]

AE: You’re spot on though when you say your album is pretty serious lyrically or at least tackles some heavy subjects, but instrumentally it breaks from that. BB: Yeah, I’m glad you think that. I tried hard to do that. It was interesting actually, it ended up being kind of a breakup album but it wasn’t to start off with. There were more songs – not many more – but there were a few more that right at the end I was like, these songs don’t fit in with this collection of songs anymore. So I took them off the album and what was left just happened to be breakup themed. I mean they’re not all break-up songs but more about love and life in general.

AE: It’s interesting actually because I think maybe, and this is just what I’m getting in our conversation now, although I was going to ask about it – this seems to be less of a breakup album and more of a learning album. And maybe that’s why the lyrics can be what they are but the instrumentals are a bit less heavy. BB: Did you say learning? Yeah! I definitely think that’s what it is. It is more about learning. I’m in my 30s now, in June I turn 33.

AE: I just turned 33 myself! BB: I thought I would be really sad being 30. When you’re 16 years old looking at being 30 it’s terrifying. Like I would be really old. But now that I’m here, I couldn’t love it more. I like that I can still feel like there’s a sense of still learning who I am and how I react to things. I’m learning what my new priorities in life are. It feels really healthy. I think the biggest thing when I turned 30 – and it almost happened overnight – is that I just didn’t care anymore about what people thought as much. (Laughs) You know? I’ve always cared! My opinions were always based on what would other people think? Mom and Dad may not think that’s really cool or my management might think that I’m being too stubborn or my label may not think I’m open-minded enough because I’m not working with this person. I was always worried about how other people would react. And now I’m just like, screw it! Nobody is thinking about me as much as I thought they were. And that’s actually such a relief. It just took so long to figure that out. It’s like why couldn’t I have figured this out 10 years ago?

AE: That’s so funny because I could not agree with you more. But you have to go through all the bullshit in order to have that awakening of: You know what, this is not something that needs to be a priority. BB: Is it because we’re older now? Because in your twenties you’re thinking you’ve got plenty of time. We’ll make it happen. And then when I turned thirty I was like, I can’t f–k around anymore. And suddenly you really learn what your priorities are. And my priority became: I need to be happy. I need to be happy doing my job. If I’m not happy making music then I shouldn’t be doing it because it’s not going to be very good.

AE: Oh yeah! Definitely. And as a listener I always feel like I can tell if someone’s heart isn’t into it. I mean maybe not with every artist, and obviously everybody has different taste in music, but the more I can connect emotionally or feel like whoever is singing has an emotional connection to whatever it is they’re singing – no matter what it’s about or what genre they’re doing it in – doesn’t matter as long as there’s some kind of connection to it. I think as a listener I’ll be able to appreciate it more. And there’s so much music out there now that I just don’t hear the connection at all. BB: It’s actually quite an art. A producer I worked with once, years ago, was telling me how he was brought up listening to the Beatles and it never mattered what they are singing they always sang like they meant it. Sometimes they would sing ridiculous things but there was always a connection. I’m glad you pointed that out to me because yeah, as a singer you need to bring that performance. You have to feel it. As an artist I’ve always wanted to do that. I don’t want to be a throwaway artist. I want to bring something that moves people. I enjoy being moved by music and that’s when my heart explodes and I get inspired. That’s the power of music. It’s bigger than me. I don’t know how to describe it – it’s just inspiration.

AE: Well for me at least, it really came across on this album. One of the things that is striking to me, because you’ve been making music your entire life, is your ability to keep learning after all this time. This is your first independent album and it’s self-titled. Would it be right to say this is your most personal album? BB: Yeah. Well actually, I recorded my debut album and then got signed. So I did have a freedom on that one. But still, I made that album when I was about twenty-two and I had it in the back of my head that I would love to be signed to a label. But going into this album I knew that I just wanted to make a really good album. I didn’t know how I was going to promote it; I didn’t know if we’d have the funds to do that. It’s only through touring for other people and kind of doing odds and ends jobs that I can actually afford to even promote this album. It’s completely [let’s out heavy sigh and laughs] it’s completely sucking me dry right now.

[Laughs] But I really feel strongly after looking back on this album, and from people’s responses and even friends just listening and saying, “This is a really good one.” Even then they’re like, “Even I listen to it.” [Laughs] It says something when your friends are listening to it for their own enjoyment and not just because they have to because they’re friends. They’re like, “I keep it in the car and I put it on myself.”

AE: Ha! Yeah no one forced my hand. BB: And so I was like, maybe I do take opportunity on this album and really go for it. So yeah, I put my money where my mouth is.

AE: Well sometimes I suppose that’s what you really need to do in order to test yourself and see if you’re doing it for the love or if it’s too much of a pain in the ass. BB: Yeah! Well the thing is I have different expectations now. Quite simply it is that I really do need to enjoy it. So a lot of my decisions now are based on is it going to depress me if I do this for months on end. Or do I go out with friends on tours? It all kind of changes the whole decision making process. One of the reasons I wanted to put the time and money into giving this album a good shot is that there’s also this side of it that if I’m spending this much time making the album it feels selfish of me to have done unless I can feel like I’m giving something back. Which to me is people hearing the music. But it’s also met with, if people don’t know about it, they can’t listen to it. I want to make music people hear and it becomes a part of their life and they make their own stories to it. So when they listen to it ten years from now it takes them right back to this moment ten years before. That’s what I want to do hopefully.

AE: It’s funny because there was a quote from your bio, I think, where you talk about approaching this album and each of the songs as though you were scoring a short film. And so much of my own musical experience as a listener is tied to the emotions that songs bring up and what I picture in my mind while listening. So for me that was refreshing to hear because that’s the way I enjoy experiencing it. And not everybody does that while creating music. Either their songs are too personal so nobody can have their own experience with it or they’re just like, “Eh whatever.” BB: Yeah I’m somewhere in between. At some point when I’m writing my songs it does have to be personal. You want it to be genuine and emotional but when I put my producer’s hat on I say, this needs to be for other people as well. I guess that’s what I enjoy doing anyway. Because I hear music that way too – I hear it very visually. I’ll associate a song I like with color or I guess whatever is happening at the time. I’ve always been fascinated with scoring films. I’ve always wanted to do that. So I guess this is me trying to do both at the same time.

AE: You should get into that! BB: Eventually I will, I just don’t have any time. It’s always one of those things where I was like, “I can do that when I’m wrinkly and gray and nobody has to see my face. But if I want to be kind of a pop artist I have to do that while I’m younger.” Now I’m just like, I’m going to do it all.

AE: And you should! There’s so many different ways of doing it now with the web and more short films and more web series there’s a lot of different opportunities to play around with. BB: Yeah and there are a lot more people out there making short films and more indie films are being made. I’m not sure if I’ve got the statistics right, they’re probably totally wrong, but I think I read somewhere that at the last Cannes Film Festival, something like 10 percent of the films were funded by a KickStarter campaign. So that’s pretty awesome. You’ll have to look it up to make sure it’s right, I’m pretty terrible with numbers. [Laughs]

AE: That’s an incredible amount of money being raised, especially when thinking about funding a whole film. BB: I know! I mean I think funding an album is expensive but then you look at the film world and the money just blows my mind.

AE: Well I still think you and Missy should do a web series like Austrai – Austrailandia. BB: That’s hard to say.

AE: Yeah, I was starting it out and trying to figure out where to go after that second syllable. Not my best work. BB: That’s funny – so I think what you’re saying is for us to do more like a web series than a music video.

AE: Well all of the above! You can post the outtakes and everything. You two just seem to have a lot of fun with each other so if it’s something you’ve got the time to do and are able to do it, I think you should go for it. I’ll post them! BB: I hadn’t thought about it but that’s a good idea to maybe document our trip that isn’t just like a regular tour diary.

AE: Yep, just have fun with it. Create different characters. Then when you’re bored you can just go crazy.

Alright, so I’ve got one more question and then I’ll let you get back to dealing with your allergies. You talked about touring with Sarah McLachlan but have you kept in touch with her? Because I think she needs to know – and this should come from a friend – the ASPCA commercials have ruined her song “Angel” for me forever. BB: [Laughs] She knows! She knows! She has raised so much money for them through that ad campaign though. She’s said it onstage before, she’s like, “I can’t even watch those commercials anymore. I didn’t know they were going to be that tragically sad.” In the part that she filmed, there was a dog who was sick but it wasn’t the dogs that were like, missing…

AE: Missing the eye! MISSING THE EYE! BB: And legs, and ears. So when she saw the final thing she was just like, this is so sad and tragic. But it works. It stirs something in people.

AE: Yeah, it stirs tears in me. I hold my own animals tightly and then we turn off the TV because I can’t handle it. BB: And it’s been running now for so many years. Sarah was saying maybe she should do a new one for them.

AE: Well, actually they do have a new one with Wendy Malic and I was really pissed off that they changed it because I didn’t know what the cue was going to be for the sad animals to appear onscreen. Because there was no song and then all of a sudden, dog with one eye. BB: [Laughs] Yeah they should just give you snippets of the song as a warning and then go into the commercial.

AE: By the way, I would like to request that the Aussies don’t get to be the only ones that get the Butterfly-Missy tour. BB: Me neither! I really hope we get to bring it to America. There is talk about it maybe later in the year but it does depend on what other tours either of us might get. But I think it will be a really fun tour to do and I really hope we can tour America. That’d be cool.

AE: I hope you don’t think I’m blowing smoke up your ass but I really do connect with your album. Each song is very different and you can tell that there was a lot of care put into each song. BB: I’m so glad you are able to hear that in the album. Thank you so much. I really want to make meaningful music. You know for an indie artist it’s really difficult to get your name out there and make sure people know your songs exist. So having people just talking about it and spreading the message through word of mouth is so helpful and I hope people know that we really appreciate it.

You can keep up with Butterfly via her Facebook, Twitter or Website and I strongly encourage you to join me in twenty seconds of pure dance. You can find instructions here.

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