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JD Samson on playing Occupy Wall Street and representing for the queer community

We are a protest band. We are here in solidarity as feminists, queers, and part of the greater 99 percent.

We are here to support immigrant rights, workers rights, and the Occupy movement.

But this is not a day to divide, this is a day to stand as one.

We will not only protest, but make a collective promise that we will never ever back down.

That we will never weaken our intelligent force, and that we will only get stronger.

We must remain simultaneously angry yet hopeful and continue our constant support for each other.

And most importantly give gratitude to this incredible crowd.

We can not do this alone. We need this choir. We need this team.

– JD Samson’s speech at the May Day Occupy Wall Street event

JD Samson has had, and continues to have, an enviable music career as part of bands like Le Tigre and MEN. While I knew she wasn’t living it up Mariah Carey MTV Cribs-style, it wasn’t until I read an article she wrote for the Huffington Post, that I realized how similar a touring musician’s lifestyle is to my own – and pretty much anyone who freelances for a living. It’s scary to get older and realize your life’s work won’t be able to provide a way for your eventual retirement. It’s even more scary to think about what other options you may be left with or the time and money it might take to learn a new trade. To add more complexity to this already-complex equation: When you live in a body that doesn’t fit the social norm, how do you fight bigotry and ignorance when you’re no longer in your comfort zone?

These are all questions JD is asking and also in the process of figuring out – but she’s not just doing it for herself, she’s doing it for everyone. We spoke with JD the morning after the May Day Occupy Wall Street event where MEN played in support of everyone marching and fighting for the 99 percent.

AfterEllen.com: First of all, you occupied Wall Street yesterday. And you occupied with a little music, playing in the middle of all of the action. Can you tell me about that experience?

JD Samson: It was awesome. It was basically the most beautiful thing ever. [Laughs] We got down there around 4:30 and our stage was on a flat bed truck so we played as everybody passed us by and it was really cool. Unfortunately we didn’t have that much time because the march was held back a little bit so it was tricky situation. We were not sure if that they may more may not want to book a rally around a stage so the timing was a little off a little bit.

AE: Do you think that was a police play?

JS: Yeah I think they wanted to kind of deter a group of people gathering together so they wanted the march to sort of disappear. The idea was we were going to play as they passed up but they didn’t want a big riot at the end. They wanted to disperse people down the blocks surrounding the area.

AE: That’s kind of understandable.

JS: Yeah, it’s crowd control. Our set was cut short but the sound check was awesome. [Laughs] It was cool. Actually the bikers came down first so they were all there watching the set and that was really fun.

AE: That’s awesome.

JS: I mean the sound check. Yeah.

AE: Were you playing your new stuff?

JS: We played three songs. We only had 15 minutes. We played “Boom Boom Boom,” which is a song about war time economies, and we played “Make Him Pay,” which is about the occupy movement. And we also played “Who Am I to Feel So Free?”. But we didn’t get to play an actual set. Our time got cut off.

AE: You played it in your hearts.

JS: Yeah, we did. [Laughs] Exactly.AE: The New York protests, from what I could tell, were peaceful but it seems like from the news there were occupiers in Seattle who were busting out windows and reeking havoc. To me it seems like the movement is so large makes it very difficult to get the right points across. There are so many anti-occupy folks that are pretty much only taking the violent acts with them and it’s hard to argue with them with these kids who are breaking shit or making a statement that’s worthy of listening to. How do you think the movement can come together? Do you think it’s possible to get one big message across?

JS: I think one of the things in the infrastructure of the occupy movement because there is both a positive and a negative being that there is no real person in charge and no real hierarchy of position which is kind of a really amazing way to do this which is to say we’re all together on this. We are the 99 percent and I think that’s the most powerful thing about the occupy movement that we’re all equal here and we’re all going to figure out how to do this together. But I do think at time it’s been its back fall. There are some people that get out of hand and in meetings sometimes it’s difficult to be clear about what’s going to happen and things like that. That’s what happens with any society. There is always some sort of mass confusion. If you think about occupy as in the long term this is still the beginning even though it’s been happening for eight or nine months or however long on the streets I think it could still be growing more and more.

AE: I would agree. Things are just not happening yet and since this is an election year I’m just terrified of what our country could look like next year.

JS: Yeah, it’s interesting how the seasons have sort of shifted the movement. So much of it is about being outside and getting on the streets and taking over spaces and things like that and being that the winter has come and gone I think that it’s time to reignite the fire. Yesterday for me it was really great to get a visual of how many people are still there and ready to fight. There were 15,000 people yesterday.

AE: The way that you describe it actually brought to mind the Pride parade with the marches. There must be a sense of pride of being together and marching against something that is bigger than yourself. Your new song “Make Him Pay” is a total jam. I’ve actually posted it on my blog last week and since then I’ve heard a few remixes. There is something interesting about dancing to a song that has such a political message behind it and thinking about the lyrics there seems to be some kind of sadness attached to it. I read in one of your tweets recently that it seems like you’re not being taken seriously based on your appearance, I can totally get that in a different body, what I think is really interesting is that you have always really just been pretty fearless about just not conforming and just being who you are and I would think that now the world at least in some areas would be more accepting place than it has been when you were first starting out so how do you feel it has changed, if at all, over the years?

JS: Let’s be honest – so much has happened and we’ve had a complete gender revolution, at least the beginning of one in the last 10 years. I feel very fortunate to have been in the right place at the right time in the fact that I was supported and kind of put on a pedestal for being gender queer. It’s been really lucky for me and really helpful for a lot of other people to even just see my face in magazines or on stage and I think that’s part of my activism just being alive and visible in the world so people can feel like they have the freedom to look however they want. That’s been really awesome and obviously there are always a couple people who are not going to understand.

I think for me the biggest thing is I tend to pass as a young boy, you know? And that’s like a complicated thing because you don’t really know if people are being condescending to you because they think you’re a young boy or if you’re gender queer or what it is. I would just say that it’s hard to live in a body that’s different from everyone else – or, not everyone else but a lot of other people. Sometimes I walk down the street and I feel a sense that I’m still a freak and I think it’s something that I’ll always deal with because of my history and feeling oppressed for many reasons. One thing I’ve thought about a lot recently is promoting confidence. I feel like as a teenager I didn’t have that and I wish I could help other young queer kids and gender-queers and women learn how to feel good about themselves. I always come back to that as the reason I may still effected by what people say to me, you know?

AE: Well it’s hard not to, especially if you – and I could be putting words in your mouth here – but it kind of seems like you carry a lot of the weight of other kids going through your experiences, on your shoulders. And so you’re trying to be positive for them but it’s difficult because sometimes you need someone to be positive there for you.

JS: Yeah. Yeah!

AE: I totally could have just pulled that out of my ass. But it does seem to me like anybody who’s in a position of kind of needing to be the voice of a particular group –

JS: Yeah, and I think it’s been important for me to take on that role. You know, I think if I wasn’t repeating comments from people like, “You helped me be who I am. You saved me,” or, “I never had the confidence to do this until I heard your music or read your article,” or whatever – and I think that that’s what keeps me going in my own life and to continue to be there for other people.

AE: Well I know from reading your Tweets that you’ve got a special relationship with your grandma – and I’m obsessed with mine so I get this. Do you talk to her about any of this? I think she’d have an interesting perspective.

JS: I mean, we talk a lot about kindness and just trying to be the best person you can be. We’re both very sincere and kind of emotional in a sense that we’re in touch with our feelings. So I think when we talk about things, it’s just trying to get past hard moments and look forward and know how much strength we have with each other and how much unconditional love we have for each other. To be honest, that’s a good way that I’ve found – obviously some people are going to cut you down no matter how nice you are – but I think the most important thing is to try and be the best person you can be. Wake up every morning and say you’re going to try to be fair and try to be honest and understand my own feelings – I know this is starting to sound cheesy and like Deepok (Chopra) or something. [Laughs]

AE: [Laughs] No, not at all.

JS: Kind of what I’ve realized, especially as someone who’s kind of a public figure, is try and not be a part of a mess. Just try to be part of something positive.

AE: I can definitely understand that feeling. Of course, I can also know how difficult that can be.

JS: Yeah. It’s really interesting because you’ve gotta understand yourself if you want to put yourself out there. I think sometimes it’s really scary because if I don’t understand what I’m feeling –

Or like in music making, even when it comes down to writing lyrics sometimes, I want to write a song about how I’m indifferent about this thing – but then I’m like, no, I want to write this song and be confident so that these people feel confident too. So that’s been a big struggle in writing this record because I want to say that I’m sad and I want to say that I’m confused but then when it comes down to it, I want to be the face of somebody who brings confidence and is sure of what’s happening but maybe isn’t sure of the outcome but knows what their feelings are. You know what I mean? It’s been interesting because I’ve been trying to write intelligent but confused lyrics and it’s hard [Laughs]. I do want to come across as though I’m strong. You know?

AE: Yeah and that’s actually really interesting to think about because I think part of being confident about something is also maybe going through different stages of confidence. So going blindly confident into something that would be one thing – but then questioning things and maybe being a little bit nervous but maybe knowing that afterwards, if you get a lot of people to help with it – I don’t know, maybe if you build it it will come.

JS: [Laughs]

AE: Wanting to get across your feelings about things but also wanting to be confident, I definitely think there’s a place for both of those.

JS: Yeah, and I definitely think “Make Him Pay” is a good example of that because the lyrics say, “You don’t know, you don’t know, you don’t know what I am. If I don’t kiss your ass you think I’m biting your hand.” Which is kind of like I’m somewhere in between. You don’t understand me but I’m going to come together with my people and we’re going to take over.

And “I Don’t Care,” the song we put out with Cyndi Keith, was kind of like myself talking to myself about all kinds of issues. One of them being the apathy I feel at the moment of like, pictures or something like that and both understanding but also criticizing that apathy at the same time. And I think that kind of abstract contextual ways to produce a song is really interesting to me. So we can talk about my duality without saying it literally.

AE: I really am enjoying everything that I’ve heard from the new EP. Well you have two EPs coming out now.

JS: Actually, I think we’re dropping the idea of EPs and we’ll just put out the full record instead. We’re really excited about it. Basically, the first CD we put out, we wanted to do a soft release and then we were going to release another one but we held it back because there was a weird moment when we decided we weren’t ready to do it. The songs are a little bit poppier and I’m really excited about them but we really wanted them to fit in to the context of the record. Also, we got really excited about the conceptual sequencing of the record and felt like just putting out the EPs instead of a full-length would leave a little less room for that. So it’s complicated but we decided to put everything out in September.

AE: Sweet! I can’t wait to hear the whole thing. So I mentioned the HuffPo article from a while back when we first started speaking because I really found it enlightening and frightening [Laughs]. As a freelance writer I certainly struggle with some of the same fears as you do – and really anyone who is living as a freelancer – well, a lot of the work I really love is the stuff I’m either doing for free or getting paid very little to do it. Putting it all in a box with the film degree I got and am doing nothing with!

JS: [Laughs] Yeah totally.

AE: But right after you posted, it was right around the time that Google+ was launching and it got me thinking about all this different technology available that would allow for a virtual co-op or swap of lessons in something you’d want to do. And now iTunes and some universities are offering lessons to download for free. I don’t really know how it works but it’s there!

JS: Wow, I didn’t even know about that. But yeah, actually the drummer of our band right now was saying a really good idea for people in our industry who are no longer able to make money with the loss of record sales is to diversify your project. So one of the options is to teach and give lectures at colleges and kind of change your genre a little bit and work in different kinds of venues.

Another thing, like you said, with technology bringing people together, it’s been really nice to talk to other musicians who have hooked me up with ideas. And I’ve been kind of thinking of a feminist management collective. So a bunch of other feminist musicians can help each other to both manage their career, get things done, help out with tasks and that way people will all be working for each other. I’ve had other ideas too of kind of starting a Craigslist for musicians who are needing work. Whether it’s like, “I’m a drummer and I need to find a gig for a week or I need to work at a coffee shop.”

You know it’s true – we need to look to each other as musicians, feminists and queers and see what the family has to offer for us – kind of make it more of a collective and try to work that way for a little bit. But I really think things will fall into place. Things will come together and make sense and we’ll work it out somehow. I think we’ll find a way so that musicians will make money on their songs. I think the Occupy Movement is a really interesting one to talk about this in because, as you said, you’re freelance – I’m freelance. Half of the country is freelance right now. [Laughs] Or there’s a lot of people owning small businesses which is a vulnerable position to be in. You don’t know how much money you’ll make next week or if you’ll be able to pay rent and self-promotion is a really strange thing. One of the important things I need to remember is that we’re all part of that 99%. We need to try to rise up together and take what we deserve.

We’ll bring you more info on the new MEN album as soon as we’ve got it but you can also feel free to follow JD on Facebook, Twitter and of course keep up with MEN.

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