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In honor of gay pride celebrations going on around the country this week, the retro reviewers pour into If These Walls could Talk 2, which stars Ellen DeGeneres, Sharon Stone, Chloë Sevigny, and Michelle Williams.
Everyone liked the film and its examination of the progress queer women have made in the last 50 years. The three different story lines range from the early ‘60s, the swinging ‘70s, and the early 2000s. Retro Reviewing: If These Walls Could Talk 2
Make sure to check back next week when the reviewers pack up for a special beach review of Blue Crush – a movie with enough lesbian subtext (and girls in bikinis) to qualify it as retro-reviewable. Submitted by on June 21, 2008 - 1:08pm. |
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Ellen&Sharon
What can I say love Sharon Stone, love Ellen, love them together, great chemistry. And Sharon Stone is so hot with short hair.
And they talked about the movie on Ellen's talkshow (well everybody who saw the movie knew what they were talking about): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iufTKEaf7IY Ellen is so cute when she blushed, and although Sharon speaked very softly, we all could hear what she said
Oeh thanks for the link, i
less obvious blushing...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LoGSdEg8bc&feature=related
Sharon: "Do you say that to everyone you've been naked in bed with?"
I love this movie!!!!!
I cryed my eyes out when I watch the 60s part it was so sad. I love Ellen in this movie when she says why can our love just make a baby just toched me. this movie really lets you see just how far we've come and that we can go farther if we just stad up for our rights. and now that my state the California we have the right to marry and that the state is still here we hasn't been plaged our anything, the rest of the country should follow as goes california so goes the rest of the counrty.
P.S. Katie you melt my hart <3
Kappa Kappa Eat My Pi till I die
Great Movie!
The 60s segment was definately painful to watch because it's just so sad. The 70s segment was fantastic...the sex scene with Michelle Williams and Chloe Sevigny was hot! The 2000 segment was great...I mean it's Ellen and Sharon Stone!
Yeah I love this movie!
Happy Pride!
(I'm so sad I'm not going to a pride this year. Toronto pride is the best! Those Canadian girls are wonderful! NY pride is quite fun as well.)
--
http://www.drunkduck.com/Empathy/
<3
omg Alyssa
u took exactly what i was thinking re: Ellen's being in a love scene. i was just going to post that but u beat me to it lol. i've seen Ellen's talk show quite a few times and after that seeing her go at it with Sharon Stone was a bit tmi/wtf.
overall i thought the movie was okay....
I think the only good thing
Love the movie
I'll join in on the love fest and agree that ITWCT2 is an excellent movie. The first segment is something I can't watch except on rare occasions because it is so painful to watch. It's powerful acting, heartbreaking and important but I just can't watch it again. The two other segments however... those I'll watch and rewatch and rewatch over and over again. Chloe Sevigny, yummy! I think that it was my favorite of the three stories. The chemistry between Sevigny and Williams is just out of this world and never for one second did you not believe these two were into each other. Amazing!
Knowing that Ellen and Sharon Stone are friends and Ellen and Anne were friends with Sharon Stone made the love scene kind of ... squicky a bit but I have to say, the acting on that segment was great, Ellen was truly in her element with the comedy and it was so great seeing Sharon Stone goofy and fun. Loved the baked turkey baster scene :D it was cute. It was extremely well written, acted and directed, a joy to watch.
Great review, you guys. It was so much fun seeing you all so excited about this movie. It really is a must for any dyke out there... heck, forget just dykes, EVERYONE should see this movie. It's really good and I wish that movies like this would be made more.
How Far We've Come
Back in 1990, I was a Junior in college, staying in Boston for the summer. I participated in what I think was the first attempt at a Boston Gay Pride Parade. It was disheartening, to say the least. There were maybe 100 of us, marching through the city and people along the street would stop and wave, until they saw our signs and realized we were gay. Then they made faces at us or gave us the finger, etc. We just held hands, laughed at them, smiled and waved, but, it was a disappointing experience.
The next year, I went to the Gay Pride Parade in San Francisco and there must have been about 300K people. The parade itself was huge and there were people lined up to watch and cheer all along the parade route. It was great!
I haven't been to Boston in years, but, I'm glad to know that your generation is out and having fun at Pride.
Looks like this would be a
Finally watched D.E.B.S yesterday and it was indeed a funny campy film despite it being predictable at times but I thoroughly enjoyed watching it.
Anyways have fun at pride and having fun dancing I had fun the other weekend when I was dancing at my cousin's wedding.
Plenty O' Pride
I absolutely love everything about this movie. I watched it for the second time after pride last weekend and its amazing to live through a weekend like that then reflect and realize how far we've truly come throughout the years. The only down side for me was how awful I felt for Natasha Lyonne's character who couldn't get over Michelle Williams in the movie especially after falling for her in But I'm a Cheerleader, but luckily Chloe made that a little easier to watch... As a whole its one of the few lesbian movies that maintains a sense of reality and is still enjoyable to watch ... so it definitely gets a five from me!
I also wanted to say THANKS AGAIN for taking a picture with us at pride last weekend! It will definitely be my new pic here once we get around to uploading all the pics from the weekend, but I was extremely excited to run into the two of you there and you are all absolutely amazing!!!
YAY
Can't wait to see the picture!!
Rina
love this film
i remember the first time i watched this movie, i was beginning to come to terms with my attraction for women, so it really had an effect on me. the 1960's story was really poignant because that type of situation still happens today. whether a family was unaware of their relative's sexuality or were aware and didn't accept it, they still have the power to legally disavow a couple's relationship and life together.
the 1970's story was my favorite because of amy, the sexy butch, and i didn't realize why until i came out into the community and met lovely butches like her. i love how the film depicted the effects of second wave feminism in the les community and the alienation of femmes and butches which still continues today...which i can personally attest to as a femme that's been made to feel like a walking anachronism at times.
the 2000 storyline was great because it was so hopeful and i loved seeing ellen in a sex scene...it was something shocking and unexpected at the time because she had such a squeaky clean image.
as much i loved this film and was pleasantly surprised to see nia long (who played a lesbian in another film i cant remember the name) even though she didn't play a major part, i was disappointed in the lack of people of color depicted in the movie. queer people of color are an integral part of gay history in this country, from the harlem renaissance, to stonewall, to the first pride celebration on down and i wish that could've been represented in this film. you ladies should take a look at "watermelon woman" by cheryl dunye, which examines the intersection of race and sexuality.
Thanks for your comment
After reviewing If these Walls Could Talk 2 we realized that it is definetly time for us to review more ethnically diverse films. We will be reviewing The Watermelon Woman very soon, so it's so great that you mentioned it. it was something we mentioned when thinking about the next films we will review. It's such an important film in so many ways and personally I can't wait to review it.
Other films we want to review are Set It OFF and Saving Face. IF you have any other suggestions please let us know.
Thanks again for your comments.
HAPPY PRIDE!
I have hope
If my walls could talk....
Loved it!
Loved this film
Movie suggestions...
Hey Sexyseed! Here are a couple more movies you might enjoy...Everything Relative (comedy) (but w/some very good love scenes!) Claire of the Moon and of course, the all time classic, DESERT HEARTS!!! Enjoy!
Movie suggestions...
Hey Sexyseed! Here are a couple more movies you might enjoy...Everything Relative (comedy) (but w/some very good love scenes!) Claire of the Moon and of course, the all time classic, DESERT HEARTS!!! Enjoy!
hhagen I SEE THE L WORD
hhagen
I SEE THE L WORD IS COMING TO LOGO THIS THURS. CANT WAIT !! SEASON 1 WHICH I MISSED ON SHOTIME.
Could barely hear your show
I watched this movie,
I watched this movie, because you were going to talk about it here. I learned quite a bit about the 'culture' and about myself, too. For me (new in the scene but advanced in years), the 60s storyline feels most at home, the 70s, a little advanced (but most charming) and the 2000, well, it's totally another universe. I feel like a primitive accidentally transported to the futuristic world by time machine!
In the 70s segment, I couldn't understand at first why Amy (she looks so cool, my favorite character of all) was not accepted by the group of lesbians. It shows layers of prejudices among feminists, lesbians and genderqueers and what Linda says to the group sounds still new to a modern ear: Do you know why you don't like Amy? It's because you are scared of anyone who's not just like you. Wow, that's powerful.
I enjoy your vlog. It introduces me to lesbian-themed movies. :)
i think it's important to understand...
...the reasoning behind the actions of the women in the 70s section of the movie. being a butch myself, it was frustrating to watch (i am a VERY woman-identified butch, who doesn't want to be a man. fact is, i look like a pathetic drag queen in makeup and a dress; i like comfortable shoes and low maintenance haircuts), but i do somewhat understand the reasoning.
we have to remember that these were the early days of late-20th century feminism. gender theory wasn't as developed as it is now, and lesbians were really trying to define themselves in the context of gender oppression. in a culture where sexism was REALLY just beginning to be discussed in a big way, the idea of traditional gender "roles" was anathema to those attempting to separate themselves from the heterosexual paradigm.
i think the key mistake made by those women who stigmatized butch women, was never bothering to really ask butch women what their gender presentation meant to them (or perhaps not listening when they did explain it). and perhaps the language and understanding of gender wasn't there yet either. these were exploratory days, when women were just beginning to take their freedom from the ridiculousness of the 50s. in fact, androgyny was a big goal in a lot of feminist communities, for the simple fact that they were attempting to get rid of the binary oppositional gender roles. that is really at the core of a LOT of gender theory, even today.
but i think the one missing aspect is that people are individuals, with many many ways of expressing who they are. i am a butch, but i actually get rather frustrated with people who assume my gender presentation is "masculine". i am a woman. i bleed every month. i deal with sexism. i am a woman. in my eyes, everything i do is "feminine" by simple virtue of who i am. who gets to define what "feminine" means? well for centuries, men have. if we automatically assume the traditional definition of "feminine" to be the valid one, then we have once again taken on the male definition to describe ourselves.
but i don't that the gender discussion had gotten that far yet in the era of this film segment (truthfully, i still don't think we have gotten there).
even NOW, i find a lot of anti-butch sentiment in the lesbian community, for the simple fact that some STILL believe that we are "aping" the male role. i think it's still worth examining the butch/femme dynamic, because it is still there, and there is a lot more to it than simply aping heterosexual roles.
How about reviewing '80s lesbian films...
I came out in 1980, and in 1982 moved to San Francisco. I walked into Amelia's, the hottest lesbian bar at that time, my very first day in town, sat down and ordered a drink. I was only 22 then. A woman came in, sat down next to me, looked me up and down like a piece of meat, then asked me if I was butch or femme? I never forgot that.
Back then, gay marriage wasn't even a dim possibility. We considered ourselves lucky if we could walk down the street in broad daylight and hold hands with our girlfriends without being mocked, insulted, or attacked. Your generation is very lucky to live in a more liberal, accepting time. However, we do still have a long way to go. Only two states have legal gay marriage? Until the whole country is full of lesbian wives and gay husbands, we are not done. As the saying goes, we may have won a few battles, but the war still rages on.
There were three seminal lesbian films that came out in the '80s that you guys might enjoy watching and reviewing, even though they will seem dated now. "Personal Best", "Lianna", and "Desert Hearts" had a big effect on my generation. Ellen DeGeneres is only two years older than I am, so you might say these films are part of "Ellen's generation".
Really enjoyed your review of "If These Walls Could Talk 2" on HBO and last week's review of "D.E.B.S". Keep up the good work, ladies.
"It makes me think I should be doing more"
This comment hits the nail on the head about "Part 1" of ITWCT2. Its not about being depressed, its about getting ANGRY and doing something about it. Vanessa Redgrave is oh so intense in communicating what it is like to be legally tossed to the curb by the homophobic biological heirs of a lesbian partner.
So, kids, go forth and push the boundaries. Its terrific to review films and to share what makes you feel good or bad about them. However, this film reflects issues that impact lesbians on a daily basis. I would love to read your true opinions on those.
Pencil or pistol? I just can't decide.
actually one correction
when clubs were raided back in the day, butches had to be wearing at least 3 items of gender "appropriate" clothing or they would be hauled off. many times the clubs were mixed (gay men and lesbians), and when the alarm was sounded that the police were coming, the couples would switch and pair off as men and women, rather than keep their partners.
so dressing butch was NOT a way to stave off police harassment; in fact, it was guaranteed to BRING it.
:)
Okay does any one else think that Kate looks like the actress who plays Kim on Sugar Rush.
I love this movie I would have to say though that thought all around the sex scenes where great, I am a big fan of sex scenes and love it when they actully look relistic and hot, but I wish that Sharen and Ellens sex scenes could have differed a bit, they looked the same, couldn't they have spiced it up, move location do something a bit diffrent. I do love this move, both of the If these Walks Could Talk movies are good.
In my womens studies class these movies where assigned to us and I love that because this movie isn't just about lesbian rights and accievments but womens. So good pick for pride.
Loved it!
I've seen this move soooo many times. It's great. My ex gf and I used to always talk about how in the first part, when Vanessa Redgrave was crying with the pajamas, was the saddest thing either of us had ever seen. It gives me chills. She was brilliant.
Oh, and Katie, if you get any cuter I don't know if I'll be able take it! ;) *swoons*
chloe