Newsweek says "True Blood," "Grey's Anatomy and "House" are promoting gay stereotypes

Sounds like Setoodeh just wants us to blend in and pretend we don't exist.  Can't have any one sticking out...just gotta hammer every one down so we're all the same!

Bullshit!

i just read a lot of 'blah blah blah'.

The problem is how a gay man can write these loads of bullshit about gay ppl! this is what worries me

sounds a lot like those people who claim they're open minded about homosexuality but then say "as long as they don't throw their sexuality in my face" as if we don't have heterosexuality thrown in our faces on a day to day basis...

I'm with you on that one. He has a very condescending tone, slightly apathetic and verging on insulting. Yeah I believe he's gay, and it seems he's an older gay guy, ashamed of all the colors of out beautiful rainbow. 

SdQ Out!

Hot, femme, bisexual women also appeal to. . .  other hot, femme, bisexual women!  (Okay, maybe calling myself hot is a bit egotistical, but give the girl her moment--my crush on Thirteen knows no bounds.)

If these were one-off characters/plotlines (like the Heroes one looks to be) it would be different, but by showing that a bisexual woman can be with a man or a woman and still be bisexual, more people are getting the idea of what bisexuality actually is (not attracted-to-everyone, simply attracted to both sexes) and I think that's far more beneficial than harmful.

Also, Kurt is my favorite male character on TV at the moment.  His rendition of Defying Gravity this week?  Amazing.  Chris Colfer should never tone it down!

"Marriage (and the military) are sacred institutions, so it's not surprising that some heterosexuals will defend them against what they see as a radical alteration. But if you want to be invited to someone else's party, sometimes you have to dress the part."

Sad.

I'm so tired, I don't even get what he's saying...but it angered me nevertheless. I think, from this day forward, I'm just gonna ignore  comments like this and live in my own little la la lesbian land, life would be so muh easier that way.

ARE YOU EVEN GAY, Ramin Setoodeh?!?

He's throwing out double standards left and right while simulatenously contradicting himself. Oh journalism, what has become of you?

Butch women can be visually appealing to both genders, and I would like to see more of them on network programming. As long as they're shiny (I mean, it is television we're talking about here).

I think that was kind of a leading question.  I don't think you should de-gay gays to make straight people comfortable but I don't think that 'gay' should be their only character traight either, or even the driving force for character development.

I love Glee, but, and please don't correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm in Australia and three epidodes behind, I don't think Kurt ever actually has feelings for men, except that fleeting throw-away longing look at Finn.  He doesn't hang around with the guys he is supposed to be attracted to and is cast at 'one of the girls', as seen when he explains to them that amphetamines are the secret to the guys success.  He's sexless in his gayness, and as such, completely non-threatening.  By making his gayness everything about him, by smothering him in all the acoutraments of gay, he just becomes a new generation of Hollywood sissy.  I'd argue that any visibility is better than none, but we're not in a world where that is the choice any more, and I do love Kurt, but I think it'd be better if a character who actually had character to him/her beyond being fabulous was out and proud.  I'm pretty sure that the Finn/Kurt community pales in comparaision to the Finn/Shu or what have you because people are interested in the sexuality of characters with character beyond their sexulity.

...and I'm left to ponder an issue that I can see from both sides.

I'm referring to this write-up and to the write-up about the fake/vs/real lesbians.

For both, I sort of feel that the gay community just needs to acknowledge the simple fact that you'll never please 100% of the people 100% of the time.

In this instance, I can see the worth of keeping gay characters on tv as gay as they wanna be.  We need to embrace our stereotypes sometimes.  Why should we tone it down?  HOWEVER, we must admit that we can also be the voices that rail against stereotypes when we see them.  How many of us roll our eyes when we see lesbians entering the 'pregnancy' storylines on television shows?  It's a played out stereotype and I get tired of that being the ONLY story that producers think is worth telling.  All in all, these situations depend on several factors.  I suppose there's a difference between being as gay as you want to be and just being an outright boring or offensive.   (For the record, I don't find Glee's portrait of homosexuality offensive)

Now, with the other blog that Stunt Double just wrote, I'm equally torn.  I get annoyed at celebritites that use lesbian make out sessions to get attention.  I resent that they would use OUR struggle to try and titilate straight men.  I just do.  But, on the other hand...I did enjoy those pics of Ellen Page and Drew Barrymore.

What am I saying?  Life's complicated and in the end, we do see things in shades of gray.  

Keep up the good topics, AfterEllen!

seriously?! that is just stupid. i mean, i get that the entertainment industry in general isn't overflowing with decent portrayals of the LGBT community. However, the assertion that it would be better to tone down any overt "gayness" for the sake of keeping an already hetero society comfortable is ridiculous. how could that be any more productive than any crappy examples of homosexuality on t.v.?

I don't think TV needs to tone down its already-existing flamboyant characters - just show characters who aren't as flamboyant in addition to them. This should have nothing to do with pondering to straight viewers or mainstream society, but because us homos aren't homogenous and a wide array of people who fall in different places on the scale of flamboyancy = better representation. Some people are flamboyant. Some aren't. 

The last cringe-worthy sentence is true in many cases - it seems like the writer's comparing flamboyancy to wearing ripped jeans to work - and there's probably some people in power who would be more likely to respect people who aren't wildly different from them. It still sucks.

The Setoodeh's point of view reminds me of this community I found quite a few years ago on livejournal, titled something along the lines of "Really Normal Queers." The group info said that he hoped someday "Normal Queers" would be able to march their own group in the pride parade, wearing dockers and holding a sign that says "We're just like you!" 

I really don't care if there's queer characters on television that act stereotypically gay - as long as there's queer characters that don't, as well. Don't change the characters; just make sure more personalities are reflected as well.

Plus, I don't like to think of myself as being constantly on guard and monitoring my personality to "please straight people." That's a lot of energy. 

...When (presumably) one of our own is willing to throw our butch sisters and (in this case) flamboyant brothers under the bus, all in the name of furthering our acceptence.

Ya know what? There are "sissy" gay men out there, and there's probably quite a few young ones thrilled right now to see themselves in the Glee character. Straight acting gay men are not the ones that have been traditionally on the front lines, receiving abuse for being gay. It's the guys who couldn't hide or pass to save their lives. They're the ones who took the crap in High School while others kept low and hid out.

I have many issues with how GLBT are portrayed on TV - but it mainly comes from a lack of normal PDA shown, tired re-tread storylines offered, and sweeps week lesbians that soon disappear. Portraying bisexual women and effeminate men, in themselves, is hardly the problem. Cause - they exist! It's the crap storylines they are made to inhabit that's my issue.

I could rant some more, but dinner and a movie are waiting. Heh.

ALL the characters on the show are stereotypes. It's only as the season progresses that we see that beneath the stereotypes these characters are real people with real feelings. There is depth to the characters.

Also, I feel like I know a million gay men who are in love with 'Glee'...and yet I haven't heard ONE of them complain about Kurt being a stereotype and how it's horrible for the LGBT movement. The truth is, I do think that the character of Kurt IS a stereotype, but somehow Ryan Murphy makes it to where he's not an OFFENSIVE stereotype. 

I don't really think that all of his 'examples' even work...at least not for the point that he's trying to make. Though I kinda think that the whole part of THIS article is to show how Setoodeh doesn't quite know what he's talking about...and seems somewhat confused himself as to the point he's trying to make.

I mean, perhaps I'm just not very familiar with the most common stereotypes in terms of bisexual women, but not sure how Callie is perpetuating any of those.

"Marriage (and the military) are sacred institutions, so it's not surprising that some heterosexuals will defend them against what they see as a radical alteration. But if you want to be invited to someone else's party, sometimes you have to dress the part."

Reading that actually made me feel sick to my stomach. It's pathetic and disturbing at the same time.

Do you think gay characters should be “toned down” to appease a straight audience?

Hell. No.

I'm catching up on Glee, it's a show about high schoolers...THERE ALL STEREOTYPES! And, I know that stereotypes in this "gotta be PC" world (or at least USA) we live in today is making a big ole' wave but...there are butch/masculine lesbians, and effeminate gay men. Like how urban legends get started, stereotypes, good or bad, stems from real/true things.

So what, it's who some of us really truly are. Get over it.

They might as well make them straight, right away!

"I'd rather my flame burn bright than be some puny little pilot light!"

YOU SHOULD NOT EVEN GIVE THIS GUY THE SATISFACTION OF WRITING/MENTIONING HIM. you're giving this journalist exatly what he wants which is more attention to his name.

You're writing an article on the opinion of ONE person. Strange.

The first paragraph tried to condone the article, and I'm sorry but this type of article shouldn't be here. its appalling, you shouldn't even write articles like this. there are more import matters than than the opinion of some guy ive never even heard of.

'Newsweek says' who cares?
I'd rather have gay stereotypes than nothing. And i think representating of gays in true blood has been amazing so far, and im appauled theres no in depth interviews on here.

you need to get your act together AE

i had to blank on this article because it made me mad quite a bit...watchin south of nowhere helped and even idk if they are sterotypes who the fuck cares..because as someone already mentioned..its helpin alot of the youth comin out and i think it seriously is scaryin all the heteros because...they did not know that there were alot of gays hidden..and i think the writer..is a weirdest gay man who hates himself..homophobe ever...really u should watch..prayers for bobby..that movie was great and the book too.sigourny weaver was superb in it..claps hands..does anyone esle agree...and i think it retarded the last thing..about dressin up..i think gay people have been hiding and dressin the part for centuries and most of us are sick of playin a part..i know i am..i was considerin goin to the navy too...mmm...how funny..

www.myspace.com/mr.fish89

This frustrates me. I'm trying to think of something to say, but I really just don't have any words. While I do agree that perhaps Thirteen (House) may be playing to the hot girl bisexual stereotype (one episode she slept with a woman, then suddenly she was dating Foreman), Grey's Anatomy seems to be up to par. I know we're all frustrated that Callie and Arizona are shown less than the heterosexual couples, but consider: Callie is a strong, determined woman who, since being on the show, has stuck to her morals and has not only done justice to gay women discovering themselves later in life, but also to proud, independent Latina women. While we may want more Calzona screentime, we really have to just take what they're offering us. Plus, there's some great fanfic out there :)

I hope my point is in there somewhere. But no matter how progressive we become as a society (or not progressive), there are always going to be stereotypes, not just in our community, but in others as well. We just have to fight them as best we can.  

And True Blood... what a great show. Lafayette, you don't f*** with him. He's such a complex character. Especially for an openly gay man in the South. Sophie Ann, well, all I have to say is EVAN RACHEL WOOD <3 Not to mention, the whole message of the show is about acceptance. Accepting vampires = accepting gays. 

Do you think gay characters should be “toned down” to appease a straight audience?

Hmmm, I didn't even know the gay characters were "toned up".  ???  The only show that really had some sizzle was one House episode.  There's not much happening on Grey's Anatomy.  Glee is campy, comedy, tongue-in-cheek fun (I like it), but as far as being flamboyant, I would disagree and it's not like they're "doing" anything...same with Modern Family.  

As far as cable television shows, not sure why he would say anything because you have to subscribe to them...not sure why he would include them.  

If we're really 10% of the population, then I'd say we're still under-represented on Primetime television.

as a black lesbian i've found a nice lil home in the minority groups of women, african-americans, and homosexuals. and i always figure that, being a minority, we should really be more accepting of other minorities as sort of a bonding type movement. BUT it's always sad to see that there are too many gays who want to hide their flamboyantly brothers and sisters. the gay couple who stays home with their children to watch dora the explorer is no better than the gay man who wears booty shorts instead of board shorts or the lesbian who prefers men's slacks to a mini-skirt and vice versa. if this guy is gay then we should ask him, "how can we honestly fight for equal rights and acceptance if we can't accept the differences within our own community?"

If someone shows you who they are, believe them ~ maya angelou

first of all, stereotypes exist because they represent something real...yes, it's wrong to generalize or make judgements based upon a stereotype, but condemning the stereotype itself is just plain...ignorant.

and then he contradicts himself, saying that the characters are either too gay or too heteronormative -- i'm not sure if he's been living under a rock, but people, yes, even gay people, shocker, come in a million shapes and sizes. these *aren't* unrealistic portrayals!

it's articles like this -- condemning the small amount of mainstream positive visibility we have -- that give the community poor PR.

"Marriage (and the military) are sacred institutions, so it's not surprising that some heterosexuals will defend them against what they see as a radical alteration. But if you want to be invited to someone else's party, sometimes you have to dress the part." 

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some parties deserve to be crashed.

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The most beautiful smile is the one that struggles through tears--Graffiti on a bridge outside NYC 

Chimamanda Adichie:

"The single story creates stereotypes. And the problem with stereotypes is not that they are untrue, but that they are incomplete. They make one story become the only story."

I really like this quote. And feel like it covers this topic well.

I have a few questions for this author:

1) How does Sara Ramirez perpetuate a stereotype exactly? He basically states that she can't be a lesbian because she's  a "gorgeous, curvy woman straight out of a straight man's fantasy." And those two characteristics cancel each other out.....how? Lesbians can't be gorgeous and curvy?

2) Kurt may be a gay stereotype, but as someone already pointed out, every character is a stereotype on that show. And just because we may not like to see a gay stereotype, that doesn't mean they don't exist. As for the "dozens of squealing contestants" on shows like Project Runway, how can the author knock them - they're real people! The contestants on Project Runway are the basis for characters like Kurt on Glee. It's not the fault of the producers that they're cast. Some people, believe it or not, are able to see past the apparently glaring stereotypes.

3) I want to know where the article is on shows like Desperate Housewives or The Hills - because clearly they perpetuate straight stereotypes.

http://twitter.com/whyyesitscar

I think Mr. Setoodeh's article was a bit misguided but I can understand the point he failed to make. Maybe he only wants what's best for the community but there are better ways to make a point. In some ways, he sounds like nothing more than a self-hating homosexual.

It's too bad he doesn't understand that the military and marriage are not sacred institutions that heterosexuals need to protect. They are, at least in the US, institutions that our ultra religious forefathers decided were sacred so they could sanctimoniously exclude all those they deemed unfit to partake in such traditions.  Freedom of religion includes freedom from religion. We all (Americans) have the right to be married and serve our country for no other reason than that we were born in America and are entitled to all of the rights, freedoms, and privileges that that carries. It should, of course, be that way no matter where you are from.

As for certain gay characters on television perpetuating stereotypes, what straight or gay character on tv isn't perpetuating some stereotype? TV is entertainment and should be viewed as such. Would I like to see characters that are more representative of the diversity of our community? Yes. But for what it's worth at least they exist. When more lesbians and gay men hold the money positions in network and cable television then maybe we'll see a shift in the quality of gay characters. Prop 8, DADT, and Question 1 have less to do with television portrayals and more to do with religious insanity.

He doesn't like Kurt because he is too stereotypically gay, but he doesn't like Callie/Arizona/Thirteen because they are too femme? Hate to break it to him, but the stereotype of a lesbian is NOT Callie Torres. It's more Rachel Maddow or even someone like Moira from the L word.

It's kind of dammed-if-you-do, dammed-if-you-don't with gay characters. Have really effeminite gay guys and it's a stereotype, but have masculine ones and we say well they are toning down the gay. I guess the main problem is the sheer lack of characters, but even in an ideal world most shows would still have only one or two each, so I'd be willing to be they'll still kind of be tokens.

I think Janis from FlashForward is great. She is kind of in-between, like plenty of women in reality. Pings the gaydar, but doesn't scream it. And even Callie and Arizona aren't the girliest of girls, and their storylines aren't all about being gay, which to me is progress. They are multi-faceted.